Re:15yo thrower, tell me how my stats look - Throwing Events Discussion

im 6ft 1
195 pounds
4.7 40yrd
265 bench
200 clean(needs work)
320 squat(needs work)
390 dl

im more of a long lanky body

im almost 16 years old. this season i started throwin 33ft and 70ft. and i ended it throwing 44 and 115(glide)


iv been training with my coach and have gone from throwing glide to spin.. my new stats are
43(power)
46(half spin)
48(full spin)

should the increases from one to another be higher??

and disucus im only throwing 115 from power and 115 spin(needs work)

im hoping to get a constent 47 from spin as im pretty inconsistent

how do these throws look, iv been told im pretty good for being a sophmore but want more input( i turn 16 july 31)

im hoping to get around 50 foot constent by the beging of this winter for indoor track



any feedback?! =)

hit me up on myspace.com/trito911
or aim tristanmay

also ill try to get a video of the spin

thanks!

in my opinion, you've done a great job improving this year. jus keep up the good work. with your inconsistencies, you just need to practice each part of the throw seperately and get your footing down. the more you practice, the more your muscles will remember the movements and they will come easier. you jus need to make sure you are doing the right movements. =) good luck!!

I worry that moving to the spin before your discus is solid MAY be a mistake. You added 11 ft to your glide! Add a reasonable 5 ft per year and you're a 54 footer. If your discus spin develops I would look at the spin again. It also sounds like you know what needs work. Keep that speed and add some power. Move the weights less often but quicker. Good luck!

To answer your questions about throw distances yes, they should go up between your stand to your full because you are increasing momentum on the shot. As for the spin relative to the shot and discus, there must be something that your doing in your shot technique that your not doing in your discus. Take some film and look closely at every postion and make sure that in the discus your body is over your center of gravity all the way through. In the shot the weight of the shot on you neck helps to put you in the right postion but when you move the weight out like in the discus the body tends to get a little happy and moves quicker and gets out of alighnment. So check that out. As for stopping your shot rotation I would not.

Nathan,
There will always be the conversation of spin vs glide. In the above scenario you suggest to stick with the spin in the shot. Can I ask what makes you say that? I'm only curious as others have different experiences. Why would you continue this young man on the spin when it is not working in the discus ring. Thanks for your time responding.
Chris

I would first like to say thank you for coach Morriss for your question about why I would keep him on the rotation. It sounds to me like he is interested in doing the rotation for the shot, as well as for the discus, so that is one reason. Another reason is that, I know there is contriversy on this, but I truely believe that a thrower can build up more momentum, speed, and power while in the rotation, and for someone with his stats it sounds like a good idea. Third, it takes time to develope the spin, and if he is already hitting in the upper 40' with it in the shot then staying with it and becoming consestent with it will help him to increase his distances faster than if he waited for his discus to go up and then going back to the rotational shot. Fourth, like I said in my previous post the shot rotation is slightly different form the discus rotation, while they are fundamentally the same the postioning of the implement to the body and the reduced area in which to cover in the circle make it different. And lastly I have to admit I am partial to the rotation myself, but when I coach I let my kids decide what they would rather do. Sometimes I have a kid that is just a good rotator in the shot but not in the discus. It all comes down to practice, and if they like doing it they will practice it and stick with it. I myself switched back and forth so many times that it actually took me 3 years of rotational shot training, tweecking, and perfecting before I made any real improvements. As his weight lifting in his legs and arms increase so should gains on the rotational shot if performed properly. The longer you wait the harder it becomes to implement it because there will be drops in distance at the intial transfer from glide to spin but once the athlete understands the movements and can feel what is going on then the gains will come. Thank you again for the question, I hope you are able to find it helpfull.

Thanks for taking the time to explain your ideas. What I came away from your post is that you see this young man getting to a point where the spin will be the best for him. I also understand what you are saying about the subtle differences in the two events while spinning, but I would argue that if the thrower understands the physics of each event they can assimilate the goal for the individual event and succeed. Really it is mainly finding the best power position. Sure the diameter of each spin is different, but they need to understand that if they become long/balanced/and visual they would look similar. I have taught the spin to one kid in one year. I sure did have success, though it was his goal to learn it, study it, and practice it from the week after Jr year State Meet. Unique kid..and awesome.
Anyway, I worry that his shot is increasing at this level and the discus is being...forced? Maybe no separation. Dunno. A 48' footer spinning SHOULD throw farther than 120' or so. I'd like to see a 140-150 early next season. I like the two sides of the spin/glide and at my Level II class this summer I listened to experts argue amongst themselves (the brothers Judge) about when to convert. It was very interesting to hear them squabble. I think Mike has some more recent experience with HS kids so I kind of leaned toward his side. If the kid can spin try spin shot. If his discus spin is weak then glide. Add in physicality, mentality to learning, and personal goals then you have opened the "can of worms".
I guess that's our job to evaluate, cross the fingers, and hit the weight room.
By the way, where are you coaching at?
I am Smoky Hill in Colorado.
Good talking to you.
Chris

Chris,
I am a coach in Raleigh North Carolina at a 4A school, and was an athlete for the University of North Carolina at Asheville for 5 years. I was lucky enough while I attended UNCA to get my Level I coaching Cert and have not had the oppertunity to get Level II or III. I my self have gone form the glide to the rotation in the shot. In fact I was recruited for the discus but turned into a shot putter when in college. I do agree with you about the contriversy between the rotation and the glide and the technique involved, but when it comes down to the contriversy it should be up to the athlete, depending on if they are in high school or college. College should be diceded between the athlete and coach. My coach said that I would be a better shot putter if I rotated and I disagreed until my Junior year which in my opinion was a little late for me to reach my maximum potential, but I also don't think that 17 meters was to bad. I was also a 170' + discus thrower. But hey, we sould talk about other stratagies, we should start are own blog in something else or we could email. Let me konw, I am always happy to put some throwing input on the web.